Jason Cutter: So the biggest one I still take to this day is my analytical brain, which you've mentioned loves data, loves spreadsheets, loves options. My buying style is give me lots of options.

Don't force me into one. Otherwise I'm going to shut down and run the other way. So I used to treat prospects the same way. The golden rule, right? Treat other people like you want to be treated, which is wrong in the book that I'm writing. And in the course that I have, I. not to do that. Because again, Sam Crowley, if I came to you and said, here's a spreadsheet with the 15 options for mortgages, you could pick from, you know, let me know what you want to do.

You're shaking your head. You're gonna say, no, let me think about it. When the mind is confused. The automatic animal response is no, and then leave wet. So I lost so many deals because I came with what I thought was the great. Sales approach, which was here's a ton of options. No pressure. You decide instead what I realized.

No ask questions, figure out what they need, two options, three options. Here's what you said based on what you want now pick now let's go and don't overwhelm. Just keep it super simple, but targeted and exact.

Sam Crowley: What a great principle. A confused mind never buys. That's why you had mentioned when the day you were going for a walk and picked up the phone and called me or when you booked a call and we immediately started coaching together.

How many times did you hear launch with Sam? That's the only option on that podcast.

Jason Cutter: That's it. And then when people work with you and when you talk to them, you're like, okay, based on what you said, here's this option or this option. Right? Here's not 15 options. Here's not my catalog. And if it's not a good fit, go do something else.

And here's this other option or go work on this. Yeah, I learned that one the hard way, the very expensive way. It's fundamental because a lot of people just think I'm going to autopilot. They just treat everyone like they want to be treated. And that's terrible. You're a fun guy. If I give you spreadsheets, you're just going to hang up on me, right?

I got to make it fun for you. And you've got to give me data. And so that's how, you know, we work together.

Sam Crowley: Yeah, no, that's, that's pretty cool, dude. And so. When companies started bringing you in, did you feel like, geez, I don't know if I can teach, like when did this start happening when company, because we're talking about some companies with some really big pockets, they can bring anybody in and they bring in Jason Cutter.

And so when did this whole Cutter consulting and things start to start to gain traction? And when did you start to think, you know, I'm pretty good at this teaching salespeople because I don't have any background in sales. I'm self taught. And now companies are hiring me. Like, how did that all start to take off?

Cause we've got a lot of people listening to the podcast that they want to start their own movement. They want to start their own brand, their own business. And you're a guy with no experience in sales outside of, you just talked about your first time, you know, in the mortgage business, what gave you the confidence to think you can now go teach other people how to sell.

Jason Cutter: So it was two things. One is a windy path and ending up in situations where somebody else believed in me when I was an employee and then saw things in me, you know, like we all do where we see it in other people. We don't see it in ourselves. Just like I wasn't planning on being a salesperson. I was really trying not to be a salesperson.

I was also trying not to be a manager and I went to work for a company and they fired the VP of sales. And then it was like, would you like to be the VP of sales? I was basically fallen told it was like, you're now in charge of sales and operations. And then I learned, uh, that, and that was successful and I had a good time.

And I, you know, it was for Rocky road and then I would change companies and started again as a manager and worked up. And so I embraced it, even though I didn't think I didn't believe in it for myself, because I was like, who am I? Like I'm anti sales marine biology, dude. Like who the hell am I to lead people?

Then what happened is I had a spasm and I left the whole world behind and went overseas and traveled as a civilian contractor. With the military so civilian but did a bunch of deployments to a bunch of bad places for a while And uh in that time over there Uh, I realized, wait a second, my windy path is a really good gift.

It is a gift in what I have where I wasn't meant for this on paper. I'm the least likely candidate to be a successful sales consultant and trainer and coach and have a pocket. Like it makes no sense on paper. Yet, that's what leverages me so well with people is that authentic and the persuasion side.

And so, um, I realized that in the desert, I still remember the day that I, it hit me and I was like, Oh man, I am good at this and this is what I should be doing. And then, you know, taking the opposite route of Sam Crowley, I decided to work on my MBA to kind of tie in all my experiences, get more schooling, get more credits.

And then, uh, and then I came back, I got a job again in sales leadership. And then when that ended, I was like. Now's my chance. I'm going to go into consulting, take everything I've done for companies from inside and just start doing it, you know, external. That's amazing, man.

Sam Crowley: Like that's amazing. Look, Hey, if I had to, you know, I, I would have gone and got my MBA.

I would have first, I think probably would have had to get my undergrad at some point in time or even associates, but I don't, I think that's great, man. I mean, everybody has a different path to success and everybody figures out what that everyday Saturday lifestyle looks like you'd love sales. You love the analytical part of sales as well as kind of just.

Taking people. I want to talk about that going from order taker to quota breaker and also this method that you've developed called Authentic persuasion. So anything with the word authentic in it. I am all about that life, dude. I love it I think if everybody could step into their true authentic self They would be so happy because we're all like characters in a play man.

We go into the office every day We got to try to we put on a costume with a suit and tie or a nice dress and makeup And we try to be somebody we're not trying to oppress people we don't even like and all this stuff. Now you're teaching a method called authentic persuasion. I want to get to that number two.

Number one, what's it mean to go from order taker to quota breaker? And is it what give it, I know it's a whole process, but give us just the basic, how could you take somebody who's just been kind of average in sales or maybe just Starting in sales to be in a rockstar. Like, what does that look like? Is it mindset?

Is it being on the phone more? Is it asking for the order more boldly?

Jason Cutter: What's that look like? I mean, it's both the mindset and the tactical. So there's a lot of things when, and when I use the order taker kind of label and you help craft that as part of our early discussions, you're like, boom, here's what you do.

And that message was so clear. And then I ran with it, which was, was awesome from your part is the. The order taker, which sometimes triggers people and they go, they get defensive, their ego kicks in, they want to get their feelings hurt. Like I'm not an order taker, I'm a sales person. It's like if you're not closing effectively and you're not happy and you're not hitting your goals or making money and it doesn't feel right, but you have a sales type title, then it's most likely that you're.

Operating like an order taker, right? You're operating like a customer service, right? And not a salesperson. A salesperson's job is to move some, a qualified prospect from here to there, to a better state, right? Not an unqualified, that's manipulation, but a qualified prospect and move them forward. And so order taker is somebody who's generally just maybe providing information and then waiting for the buy, right?

Waiting for the. prospect to go. I have money in my hand. I'd like to buy from you. When that happens, they don't need a salesperson. They can order online or just call in, you know, off the catalog and put in their order. They don't need you, but your company hired you to persuade and sell and move the needle.

And if you're not, then that's probably what's happened to you. And you're stuck as a, an order taker. And then really the key is, is both the mindset and the tactical. So what's going on in your mind? Why are you afraid? And what's true for you. There's some people I meet and I'm, I have fortunately hired hundreds and hundreds of sales reps or seen them in organizations kind of like yourself back in the day.

I have unfortunately seen or firsthand fired hundreds and hundreds of sales people or seen them leave the sales profession. A lot of people aren't meant to be in sales. They don't enjoy it. It doesn't fit their personality. But most of it is they're just a disconnect where they think they have to be X, right?

They think they have to be a Grant Cardone or a Gary Vee, and that's not true for them. But that disconnect causes them to just fail and then be fired or quit.

Sam Crowley: And that's what you mean by being authentic, you know, and so I'm talking with my buddy Jason cutter By the way, you can pick up his ebook. I've seen it.

It's really awesome I'm, just a big fan of what jason puts out if you go to authentic persuasion. com just like it sounds you go to Authentic persuasion. com and you can pick up the power of authentic persuasion, how to become a sales superstar. Jason literally wrote the book. It's free. There's nothing to pay for right there.

And you can get access to really what's inside of this guy's mind and how he's been teaching fortune 500 companies for so many years on unlocking the power of this. So when you talk about authentic persuasion, Jason, What does that mean? I mean, I know what those two words mean. Authentic persuasion. Tell us what the method that you developed around that.

What's it mean?

Jason Cutter: And it's tough because people are asking me all the time. Well, what does that mean? What does it do? It's like, well, A, it's really simple because it's in the name, right? Authentic combined with persuasion. But the authentic part is really embracing who you are. So your strengths, your skills, your experiences.

So again, like I have been in some serious, serious debt in my life. It helps me talk to people who are in debt, like as a salesperson or working with companies. I have been in charge of marketing budgets, you know, million dollars a month marketing budget. I can talk to a company from that experience and it's authentic.

Like, here's my thing. I have never, you know, had a serious Kind of addiction issue. So I wouldn't authentically be able to help somebody in that. So you have to know what's authentic for you, your experience, your skills, what you love, and then you have to address those fears that are getting in the way that are most likely those primal caveman lizard brain parts of our brain that still thinks there's a saber-tooth tiger that's trying to kill us.

At every moment of the day and it's really not like just pick up the phone or just talk to that person like you're not going to die and then that's the authentic piece and what's true for you and then why you want to do sales like why are you even in it and not just money money is always a thing like I'm in sales because I want to make like but why do you want to make that money what does that mean for you or is it not about money like for me it's not necessarily about money it's just about helping people what are you driven by or what are you trying to prove to the world like whatever that is And then the persuasion part, it's about using persuasion instead of manipulation.

And it's about having a process that you can apply to any sales kind of method, but just the fundamentals of rapport and empathy and building trust and hope on the back of the authentic side where it's true. And then you're basically taking someone and the best example I use a lot in my training. is to think about how a doctor sells, right?

So a doctor, you go into a doctor with a broken leg, the doctor doesn't say, Oh, your leg's broken. Here's your options. Just let us know what you'd like to do. Ha ha ha ha ha. Here, oh, let me, let me do this. Let me send you an email with more information. You get back to me when you're ready and then we'll move forward with something.

You just let me know. Talk to your wife or talk to your boss and then let me know, right? It's funny because you laugh and everyone laughs when I say that, but that's what salespeople do all day. You have a problem. You are broken. Your leg is broken and going to fall off. I have the solution. Pay me now. I will help you and I'm going to do that because I care about you.

Not just because I need the money, but just because I care about you and want you in a better place. That doctor doesn't do it. Doctor does their tests. They look at it. Your leg is broken. We're going to fix it. Any questions? No? Okay, boom. Yeah, right. And so it's making that shift.

Sam Crowley: And I think some people struggle with, well, I don't have something as serious as that, that I could tell somebody that, look, you need this car.

We're just going to do it. So there's no questions being asked. They have other options from other dealers, but I would come back, come back with that, you know, and hit it back to them and say, look, you got to believe. That it is that serious, like my mom used to drive jalopies all the time and I remember one time my mom used to be the one smoking no seat belt on, you know, she'd have about four scotches and we'd go to the grocery store, you know, and the passenger store, the passenger door would fly open and I don't even have a seat belt on.

I'm like eight years old, you know, I'm like, So when I remember when we went to a car dealership, I'm like, Oh my God, we're actually going to get a car. I might not die, you know, like the car door, like the car door might shut, you know,

Jason Cutter: you might make it to your 10th birthday.

Sam Crowley: Exactly. And I think that, I think, you know, that was kind of an important deal that we got a new car.

And when we walked into that dealership, we did have a really good salesperson who listened and wanted to know what we could afford. And, but the whole point, whether you're a speaker, a trainer, a seminar leader, a car salesperson, a dentist, a doctor, you got to believe that what you have. Is something of incredible value.

You can't have that. Like you said, the negative enemy in your mind, talking about that stuff. You know, a lot of people sabotage their own success. When you agree with that a hundred percent. And so that's why I think being authentic is great. Cause you get to be who you are. Like I get to do every day of Saturday, meet cool people like you.

I put it out there on my podcast. Hey, if we can't laugh, we can't coach together. Like I like to laugh. I like to have a good time. You know, if I can have a beer with you, a cup of coffee, that's great. Just don't take on clients that I can't have that relationship with. And, and that's, what's being authentic is all about.

You know, you don't have to be in sales and feel like, Oh, this is a grind. You know, it can be fun.

Jason Cutter: And that second part that's usually missing with a lot of people is the persuasion piece and leaning into it. And then knowing that they're helping people and seeing it as their duty in sales to move that forward.

And then how do they do that so that it doesn't feel slimy and wrong. from a sales perspective. And that's really what I focus on teaching a lot of people is how to do that, where you're just assuming that you're the professional and you're in charge, no matter what you're selling.